The College of Cardinals

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Appeal Directly to The Pope

Post by Kingdom of Calabria on Sun Jan 17, 2016 6:39 pm

Being so close geographically to The Papal States, having it's defense is equal to the defense of the Calabrian Republic. Any issue which effects the Papl States will surely effect our region. It is in His Eminence's best interest to bypass the election process and appoint Bishop Piero Cosenza to the vacancy.

If His Grace continues with the normal course of elections, we, The Calabrian Dukes, beseech the rest of the world to grant Bishop Piero Cosenza with the humble honor of a seat at the College of Cardinals.


Last edited by Calabrian Republic on Sun Jan 17, 2016 7:23 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : post title)
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Re: The College of Cardinals

Post by The Ruthen State on Sun Jan 17, 2016 7:17 pm

House of Judah wrote:To both candidates, I ask of you: Is a knight of other than Christian faith entitled to the privilege of ransom?
Münsch would respond with: "It depends on the nation and the monarch they are knighted by."
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Re: The College of Cardinals

Post by Kingdom of Calabria on Mon Jan 18, 2016 12:56 am

Bishop Piero Cosenza: "The Calabrian Republic does not pay ransom regardless of a knight's religion, stature, or vassalage. Our nation's Allegiance is to Almighty God; His Will be done."
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Re: The College of Cardinals

Post by Hellas on Mon Jan 18, 2016 4:47 am

I must ask, Sir Bishop, what is God's will on the ransoming of knights?
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Re: The College of Cardinals

Post by Kingdom of Calabria on Mon Jan 18, 2016 2:30 pm

"While it is beyond any one of us to know His Will perfectly, He makes himself clear in the matter of ransom.  Proverbs 21:3, 6-7, & 18 lay a good case against ransom:

'To do justice and judgement is more acceptable to the Lord than sacrifice.

The getting of treasures by a wicked tongue is a vanity tossed to and fro of them that seek death.  The robbery of the wicked shall destroy them; because they refuse to do judgement.

The wicked shall be a ransom for the righteous, and the transgressor for the upright.'"
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Re: The College of Cardinals

Post by House of Judah on Mon Jan 18, 2016 5:54 pm

"I believe you are both mistaking my question. It has become the custom in Europe that a knight taken by opposing forces as prisoner upon a battlefield is not to be executed but instead afforded the opportunity to have his liege of family make payment for his release. Is a Muslim Knight entitled to the same privilege? A Jew? A pagan?"
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Re: The College of Cardinals

Post by Hellas on Mon Jan 18, 2016 6:05 pm

I cannot se the correlation between the verses and the ransoming of knights.

We can take from the passages meaning as we see it, but as I see it, it is not just to kill a man for doing his duty.
Do you truly believe all good fighting men are wicked? Should your countrymen be treated this way if captured?

Is their death in stead of brokerage not a sacrifice? Would the Lord not then prefer ransom?
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Re: The College of Cardinals

Post by Hellas on Mon Jan 18, 2016 6:17 pm

A good point Cardinal Daniel, my apologies.

In any case, let it be known that those of all faiths are seen equally under the law in Cybelos. As it has always been.
This, of course, extends to ransom.

A Christian from the Saexenlands, a Jew from Jerusalem, even a Muslim from fair Malta, Bishop.
All should be seen the same and be granted thier rights accordingly.


Last edited by Cybelos on Mon Jan 18, 2016 6:23 pm; edited 2 times in total (Reason for editing : continuity)
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Re: The College of Cardinals

Post by Kingdom of Calabria on Mon Jan 18, 2016 8:01 pm

"My good fellow, the text is plain, but let me explain my reasoning:

Verse 3 is in reference to whomever is to pay the ransom. The ransom is the sacrifice of monies, not the sacrifice of a knight's life. After all, we be-knight only the righteous and upright to provide the justice and judgement of His Holiness and our Archduke. Each knight is fully aware that his life may be cut short in war, so why would his life be 'sacrificed'? Is it not already sacrificed, in a way, by us of noble birth calling it 'servitude'? I beleive Our Lord knows a knight's station and mortality, and to pay (or sacrifice monies) a ransom for his honor to his kingdom is unjust. Instead, those being called upon to sacrifice their treasury should instead exact justice and judgement upon the transgressor. This is where Verse 18 applies. There would be no reason for our knights to be taken hostage by freindly kingdoms. If they are then those kingdoms cease to be freindly. They are, by nature, wicked and therefor enemies. The wicked shall be the ransom, not the money. Which means to say, our Republic will do everything in it's power under The Almighty's true guidance to rescue a righteous and good captured knight. The transgressor may ask a ransom, but will end up paying with his life.

Never shall monies be forwarded to evil and wicked nations."
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Re: The College of Cardinals

Post by Kingdom of Calabria on Mon Jan 18, 2016 8:09 pm

"And as far as knights of differing countries and faiths:

Why would Archduke Saverio II be asked for the ransom payment of a knight which is not his? But, if the question at hand is 'Are knights of differing faiths equal?' my response would be 'Of course, as long as the knights are of equal Righteousness and Goodness.' If the knight in question is an enemy knight my response would be, 'Of course not, they are the enemy.'"
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Re: The College of Cardinals

Post by House of Judah on Mon Jan 18, 2016 8:38 pm

"I see. And Bishop Franz? How do you mean that it depends upon the nation and monarch?"
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Re: The College of Cardinals

Post by Hellas on Mon Jan 18, 2016 9:06 pm

I do not believe a knight has sacrificed himself by way of servitude. Most fighting men are willing to fight not due to patriotism or a duty to God, it is gold, such is human nature. You can not expect me to believe a soldier would fight noblemen's wars if they were not getting paid.

It is the belief that these soldiers hold that they are less likely to be harmed if captured in battle due to ransom laws.
So how do your nation's soldiers feel when fighting?
Knowing that if captured, their nation will not pay ransom seeing it as unjust, you couldn't expect to form an army in these times we live in without the protection of ransom, I believe.

You say you would do anything to rescue a captured knight, but why would the captor bother holding the knight instead of killing him if he wasn't to be ransomed?

Let me say, I appreciate you answering the main question asked.
I wish you the best of luck with your election Bishop, truly. It has been a pleasure.

-Cardinal Lysander of Tyrn
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Re: The College of Cardinals

Post by Kingdom of Calabria on Mon Jan 18, 2016 10:57 pm

"Cardinal Lysander, do you mean how do the Knights of the Republic feel, or how do the soldiers feel? The two are different and I'd like to answer truthfully.

As far as why a foreign power would hold a knight for ransom instead of execution I do not know. That would be up to the entity in question. I would assume they would ask because of common practice, in the hopes of filling their coffers. This strikes at the heart of Proverbs 21:6-7. The wicked will seek monetary compensation, when in actuality, they seek their own death."
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Re: The College of Cardinals

Post by Hellas on Tue Jan 19, 2016 12:20 am

I would be interested in hearing what the common soldier thinks. You can go into detail about the Knights if you wish. The ransom law would apply to both, the Knight usually worth more compensation due to rank and depending on how highly regarded Knights are in general within their realms.

If your Republic wouldn't seek gold out of principle, that would be commendable. But, why seek blood?
Let me ask you, do you see it possible that a Knight or nobleman captured by Calabrian troops could redeem themselves through their actions and not silver or blood? Or is it a tightly held belief that an enemy of the Republic can not be redeemed as a previous statement of yours might suggest?
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Re: The College of Cardinals

Post by Varasd on Tue Jan 19, 2016 11:08 pm

Cardinals! Let it be remembered that there is still a vacant seat in the College of Cardinals.

We have 3 nominees: Bishop Piero Cosenza, Bagad Moribië Bishop of Nantes, and Franz Münsch, Bishop of Nantes, and Bishop Bakocz, of Varasd.

So far, Cybelos and the Ruthen State have voted for Franz Münsch, Varasd, Calabria and Bezique have voted for their own nominee. Because the College of Cardinals have started debating matters of faith, and theology, the voting will be prolonged with 2 days.
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Re: The College of Cardinals

Post by Kingdom of Calabria on Wed Jan 20, 2016 4:15 am

"Cardinal Lysander, my understanding is that it is the intention of the Archduke to govern his realm on principle and adherence to the Holy Book.  The whims and fancies of this world may change, and with it, the change in common practices.  We hold steadfast to our beliefs and traditions.  Some call us stubborn.

But yes, a captured knight always has the option to redeem himself through actions.  If the knight is not killed or injured in battle and is instead captured we have the full intention of his immediate release.  After all, we are all governed by the 5th Commandment: 'Thou shalt not murder'.  Once a knight, or any aggressor for that matter, stops being an aggressor, we must adhere to Moses' Tablets.  After all, killing a pacified non-aggressive man no longer falls under the jurisdiction of War.  And we all know there is a big difference between 'killing' and 'murder'.

As far as what the common soldiers feel, I'm sorry I do not have that information at the ready.  I can send word to Marshal Luca Russo of your inquiry in hopes of a speedy response.  If you'd like."
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Re: The College of Cardinals

Post by Varasd on Sat Jan 23, 2016 1:06 pm

The voting is now over! With Franz Münsch having two votes, he is declared now Cardinal Franz Münsch of the Ruthen State. May he serve with wisdom granted him by our Lord!
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Re: The College of Cardinals

Post by Kingdom of Calabria on Sat Jan 23, 2016 5:47 pm

Bishop Piero Cosenza: "Congratulations Münsch. May the Trust of Our Lord be with you to guide your desicions. At present I will return to The Calabrian Dioscese. Should the College of Cardinals request my presence, send word to me in Reggio. Until next time, your Excellencies."
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Re: The College of Cardinals

Post by Montresque on Mon Jan 25, 2016 3:58 pm

Bishop Alerio Mont of Montresque has been elected within our nation to join, if required by the College.
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Re: The College of Cardinals

Post by Varasd on Thu Feb 04, 2016 9:48 pm

With the passing of Cardinal Laurence of the Gepidea Order, a seat is now open in the College of Cardinals. Everyone who wishes to join can volunteer now.

The Papacy shall open the voting for a new Cardinal, and the voting shall last for 7 days. The Cardinal with the most endorsement shall gain the seat.
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Re: The College of Cardinals

Post by Varasd on Fri Feb 05, 2016 9:59 pm

As for now, there are 3 vacant seats in the College of Cardinals. Everyone who wishes to join can volunteer now.

The Papacy shall open the voting for new Cardinals, and the voting shall last for 7 days. The 3 Cardinals with the most endorsement shall gain the seats.
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Re: The College of Cardinals

Post by Kingdom of Calabria on Sat Feb 06, 2016 1:15 pm

Archduke Saverio: "Seeing as we are discussing Bishop Cosenza and the matter of heresy it would not be fitting to once again nominate him for Cardinal. Instead, I wish to nominate the venerable Bishop Germano Nascimbeni, Bishop of the Greater Sicilian Diocese. I can assure you, Bishop Piero spoke out of turn by including him in his misguided statements."
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Re: The College of Cardinals

Post by Varasd on Mon Feb 15, 2016 1:21 pm

7 days have passed, and Bishop Germano Nascimbeni has been elected to the College of Cardinals!

Two seats are still open, once a nominee gains enough endorsements, shall become Cardinal.
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Re: The College of Cardinals

Post by Kingdom of Calabria on Sun Feb 21, 2016 10:37 pm

Archduke Saverio II has written a simple note from his bed: "Seeing as there are still two vacancies remaining, I wish to nominate the new Bishop of The Greater Sicilian Diocese, Bishop Federico Iannuzzi, to a cardinalship."


Last edited by Calabrian Republic on Mon Feb 22, 2016 2:36 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : location edit)
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Re: The College of Cardinals

Post by Varasd on Mon Feb 22, 2016 7:11 pm

And since there are no other nominees either, the Kingdom of Varasd nominates Bishop Bakocz as a Cardinal.

Since there is no opposition, both are accepted!
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Re: The College of Cardinals

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